Great post!

Let me be devil's advocate just for fun!

I do this all the time

I don't know why others do it but I downplay my things because I genuinely think the said project is small and basic, @ben 's article Nothing in Software Development is Obvious describes my logic behind why I might sound as though I'm downplaying things.

If something is basic, it's basic! Employers should thing relatively, if a candidate says "that project is basic" if anything it shows that the candidate has worked in enough project that something which is not actually basic is basic for her.

Your article is spot on though (here again I was about to tell you how basic my comment is)

Great post!

"Humility isn't thinking less of yourself, it's thinking of yourself less." -C.S. Lewis

We get the stupid idea that humility means we have to belittle ourselves, but that's crap. Humility means you recognize and speak about your achievements and strengths as realistically and frequently as your weaknesses and failures.

For example, I am a C++ and (almost) Python expert, and I'm good at project management, library/API design, and algorithmic efficiency. However, I have no skills with Javascript or web application design, and packaging in Python regularly kerflummoxes me. PHP is an elusive beast for me. I could list off about two dozen languages I don't know. I'm still growing, and I always will be!

This is a great post and you make an incredibly important point. I think that self-deprecation, especially in humor, is an effective method for setting up a low-ego environment, which may often lead others (especially from underrepresented groups) to feel safe enough to contribute. With that being said, I absolutely think that you are correct that this can be extremely harmful if the person performing the self-deprecation doesn't recognize his or her own value.

Whether you're new to tech or experienced, have a CS degree or not, in a career change or no, YOU bring value to the table. Our unique perspectives alone are very valuable.

I love this. It's certainly not a race or competition. Use your position to your advantage, no matter where it is. The easiest way to achieve this is by asking tons of questions. Literally ask every question that pops into your head until you know so much that everyone comes around asking your questions. People feel good when they can teach (show) you the things that they know. Make people feel good as much as you can! :)

Thank you for writing this article Mr. Hayward, I really enjoyed it!

Well put. I found this train of thought especially resonant:

Self-deprecation is very damaging especially if you are part of an underrepresented and marginalized community.

I don't doubt this for a second. From the other side – i.e. as a loud, opinionated white male (oy, sorry!) – I use self-deprecation as a tool to try and limit my "privileged" place in conversations. That is, as a method for diminishing whatever I just said when I realize that I'm over-speaking, or drowning out somebody else's viewpoint by sheer volume, or so on. It's an attempt at self-correction, though I'd wager we'd all be better if people like me could just learn to listen from the get-go instead of having to walk it back post-fact!

Again, really interesting article!

I do this often, but not because I don't recognise my own value - rather I just want to avoid yet another argument about the specific way I've done something.

Lets be honest. Some of the time, we just can't be bothered to do something "right". If you're trying to bash out a tech blog post with limited time, you may be even less likely to do it right and may focus on blogging a broad principal, failing to proof read it fully, using a generalisation or two etc.

Expressing a not-exhaustively-researched opinion is bad enough for anyone in tech, but as a woman in tech, on the internet, on twitter, with an opinion? I don't envy you.

When I was an intern here at The Practical Dev, I built a blog app in Rails to show that I could apply my theoretical knowledge of MVC to a real-world Rails app.

Every time I describe this app, I call it basic, and that I basically hacked it together. That it's simple and not very good.

It needs work. A lot of it, as far as auth, UI, etc but that is for another day.

I feel like, the way it looks, and how easy it is to do things that I don't want a user to do makes it a simple app.

I need to just either not talk about it or say, "I built this thing that took me four days. It stretched me a bit but I built it.". It really isn't a simple thing to build a full-stack app in a language you are completely unfamiliar with but I keep saying it.

This ends today.

Thanks for this article. I needed to hear it.

My hardest problem with this is a struggle to tell people about something that you know isn't done. Something you know has bugs because you made it and you know all its flaws before they even think of interacting, and personally I get wary about telling people about projects in this state. I'm not trying to little myself but on some level I fear they'll use it find a bug and write it off as broken and me as bad especially online.

Anyways, in light of the post here's what I've been working on: apps.nektro.net/

It's a suite of common-use PWAs made to serve as web replacements for the default applications that people expect to come with their devices these days. The project is on GitHub here and I work on them all the time with more apps and service workers coming soon!

Thanks for this!!!

Great article Maurice. I think one way to discourage self-deprecation in tech is to encourage open naiveté in workplace, hacker space, and anywhere.

This truly is a real challenge. I've actually had the opposite experience. I'm very confident in myself because I know myself and what my strengths and weaknesses are. When I've worked somewhere where all the projects could use my strengths, my confidence actually put people on edge, because they were not confident themselves. Some one actually said to me "it's not normal how certain you are of your ideas."

The culture of the team was to, essentially, never have confidence; always assume your idea might be wrong.

I was really flabbergasted by it to be honest. I have no problem admitting when I'm unfamiliar with something, or I don't know the answer. When I DO KNOW, I will also say that. What's the problem??

@maurice_hayward My husband and I have this discussion a lot. I always respond with: "We teach people how to treat us." I have seen every issue you raised in your post over and over again. I am 100% sure that you're right but also, I've learned, that you can't think your way into better self esteem, you have to ACT your way into it. Change the responses when you talk about a project. Even when you don't feel like it - force yourself to simply explain it as if you were talking about something that someone else did.

Here's what I know:
It's normal to be afraid and truly courageous people get through the fear by simply doing what's right
There will always be someone smarter than me and someone not as smart as me
My projects won't always be good. They won't always be bad either.
Assuming someone more experienced can judge my work better than me is not always right.
Confidence is built with bricks made of failure.
The will of the universe will never lead you where grace cannot protect you ( my way of not being afraid)

One final thought:
Self-depreciation is a dialogue running in "my" head. Those thoughts are coming from me, not the person I'm talking to. I have no idea what the other person is really going to say or think about anything. I have the power to stop that dialogue because I own it.
And so I did.

// , At first I thought this was an article about deprecating software, not whether to horn-toot.

Be careful what you wish for.

Perhaps next year: "Self-promotion needs to 🔚"